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    From David Spector on To Know Or Not To Know

    Kevin, thank you for this. I think your understanding is great. I just want to comment about one statement, which is often made as part of nonduality: “If we claim ‘to know’ Consciousness then by definition, we do not.” It depends on exactly what our “claim to know” means. We may have an incorrect understanding of nonduality that convinces us that our mind knowing something is the goal, or is self-realization. Of course, it is not, since the mind is not the true and unchanging self. No matter what the mind knows, it has nothing to do with actual spiritual attainment. However, if we know who we are, and identify as that formless, infinitely intelligent awareness, then we can genuinely make the claim to know Consciousness, because we are That. Full and pure Awareness is self-evident. And even if we are not yet self-realized, yet we claim on a philosophical basis that we are Consciousness, we are still in a real sense correct, even without the actual spiritual attainment. It’s good to be kind with ourself, and open-minded about others.
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    2022/02/07 at 5:45 am
  • Bill Smith

    From Bill Smith on To Know Or Not To Know

    Thank you for this insightful essay, Kevin.
    Like all of us in this community, I’m trying to “get home.” And yet, I want to cross that threshold and still enjoy the beauty and diversity of living on this planet. I don’t know if that’s “dual” motivations, priorities, or if it’s possible. Blake said, “Eternity loves the productions of time.” I don’t know, but I hope so.
    I’ve read Rilke for many years, and he’s often anguished by what I would call a “threshold state.” I find myself at the threshold much of the time. Sure, people can say, “But Bill, you’re there right now. You just have to realize it.” My experience is that I have to prepare, then be invited; I have no control over when I cross over.

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    2022/02/07 at 5:26 am
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      From H Hubbs on To Know Or Not To Know

      “Any expectation implies the absence of what is expected”.

      “I’m trying to ‘get home'” is the separate-self; not a problem, just another invitation to examine “me”.

      Mind is a tool, not a hangout.

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      2022/02/08 at 10:17 am
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    From H Hubbs on To Know Or Not To Know

    Thank you Kevin.

    The gift of sharing viewpoints, not to be right or wrong, but as an invitation to look again with fresh eyes.

    In so called “seeking” does our true nature change?
    Do we add, or do we remove…

    Maybe to look at awakening as an examining of the mental images that thinking presents to us as reality, and then to discover what IS (unfiltered by the thinking mind).

    Maybe to call it a recalibration of our sense of self, from being a busy lonely eddy whirlpool, struggling to survive, trying hard to keep its shape and purpose, to the relaxing realization that my true nature is water (as a mental image).

    At the root of suffering is the unexamined belief in personal doership, the idea that I make independent decisions on my own; the sense that “me” is one of 8 Billion “other” busy being busy to survive/improve circumstances.

    At the core of awakening is maybe the exploration of the nature of mind – our only instrument. Only to get clear about the “Who am I”… based on simple and effortless exploration, here and now.

    What am I, experientially, without asking the thinking mind for help? Who am I, what am I?

    Playful, lovingly, without the greed of wanting anything different than this moment.

    Thinking can only bring us to the edge of our me-bubble, for the rest we need faith, trust, bravery, or whatever the word may be.

    Without this trusting/humbling human heart-to-heart connection we might be indefinitely impressed and intimidated by our own thinking and feeling activity.

    Does the caterpillar die (psychologically) to become the butterfly?

    It is priceless to be be connected with truth lovers; I wasn’t able to pull myself up by my own bootstraps, even though what I was longing for IS always here and now.

    Peace ✌️

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    2022/02/06 at 5:15 pm
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    From David Spector on Thinking allowed...

    I agree. Covid has helped me and my wife lead a simpler life, one focused on the home and on routine and spiritual growth, instead of focused on doing things and meeting people. And look at how the pandemic has encouraged meetings like ours to spring up and flourish. Those open enough to learn how to protect themselves have not been infected, and have not infected others. Indeed, I think there is a place in our life for this tiny virus friend. It’s another part of the ever-changing play of relative life.

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    2022/02/06 at 10:10 am
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      From H Hubbs on Thinking allowed...

      The separate-self is imagined, but taken for real.
      “Virus” is a model in thinking according to germ “theory”.

      The trap of science is that it accepts only objective evidence.

      Can Life destroy itself?
      God is love.

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      2022/02/06 at 10:53 am
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        From David Spector on Thinking allowed...

        There is no trap in science. Objective evidence and the resulting knowledge is useful in relative life because it can cure or manage many illnesses. The “illusion of relativity” refers to our ignorance of our real nature as pure consciousness, not to any practical failure of relative life. Once we recognize that Brahman is true, we can also recognize that relative life is also Brahman, so to discard science is just another aspect of ignorance.

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        2022/02/19 at 6:41 am
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          From H Hubbs on Thinking allowed...

          Thank you David.

          To say “There is no trap in science” to me personally sounds dogmatic and close minded.
          Maybe to be fair, what is it that you call “science”?

          Does science create anything new?
          Does it do anything more than inventing mental models to describe/explain what nature is doing by herself?

          Is science something independent of mind?
          What is the nature of mind?

          Does science require humility, love, maturity, sensitivity, or is it just cold facts?
          Does science have an element of art/intuition in it?

          Is science free of fuzziness, of approximations, averages… is science absolute?

          Is science isolated/free from engineering, commerce and politics/public interest?

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          2022/02/19 at 7:26 am
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            From H Hubbs on Thinking allowed...

            Does mind enjoy uncertainty?

            Is “I don’t know” the equivalent of “defeat” for a materialist?

            To what degree does science take over the previous domain of religion, to create stories that “make sense” to comfort fragmented minds?

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            2022/02/19 at 3:08 pm
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    From David Spector on Monday, Monday...

    Enjoy the meeting. I will be having a root canal procedure. Such fun.

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    2022/02/06 at 10:03 am
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    From David Spector on Only the dead can die...

    Orange is between red and yellow.

    On a path there is a start and an end.

    Friendship is friendly.

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    2022/02/06 at 10:02 am
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    From David Spector on Elemental Discernment

    Thank you for this. Such a beautiful and complete statement of the heart of nonduality! I recommend this for anyone with doubts.

    As to the idea that practices are worthless, she disposes of this herself when she points out that “there is nothing to do” is just what the mind wants, to keep it going. Not only that, but she herself recommends a specific mental practice in this talk. She says, “so, when we rest naturally for short moments repeated many times as the essence of each perception, then more and more we realize the freedom that is the natural state.”

    If she is not opposed to mental practice, then what is her point about practices? I think it is that any practice should be effortless and should point or end up in pure awareness. She doesn’t use these words, but I think this is exactly what she is saying.

    So, as I’ve said before, there are many practices that point to pure consciousness, and they are worth trying. Even transcending, which can seem as a “doing” to one who is unfamiliar with it, works perfectly because it starts from the relative then extinguishes itself in the absolute. This is what is meant when Ramana Maharshi says, “The ‘I’ removes the ‘I’ yet remains the ‘I’.”

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    2022/02/06 at 7:57 am
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    From David Spector on Invite 02-05-2022

    I enjoy all these meetings, whether they challenge my ego, remind me of who I am, inject some humor into my life, or just provide fellowship along this path.

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    2022/02/05 at 4:31 am
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    From David Spector on Five Layers Of Identity

    Thank you for this.

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    2022/02/05 at 4:28 am
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    From Kevin Harlow on Me or I am?

    Nice stuff Holger, and David’s. For me it’s good to read your rambling inspirations because it’s a message that needs to get through and repetition can be very effective…’mommy, daddy’and welcome to duality.. As for a ‘defective nervous system’ couldn’t this term just be another of the infinite synonyms for Consciousness? We play the game of duality and contradiction, tirelessly. O.k, so let’s play at being a soldier, or a teacher or a tramp or scientist or whatever else you can imagine with all their particular angles, biases, limits, all the stuff that makes this game so colorful and compelling: but let’s not lose sight of the Truth while we’re at it. A faulty nervous system is no more the source of wrong thinking than a tap is the source of water. This is the disastrous game we can’t seem to free ourselves from, sufficiently. Awareness, Consciousness, is the source of the water, the tap, the bottle, Holger, Kevin, our faculty minds and absolutely all else. If we want to be real. And these are my fault thoughts and opinion. (So I foolishly believe).

    Kevin

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    2022/02/03 at 4:44 pm
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      From H Hubbs on Me or I am?

      The core “faulty thought” being “I am this body-mind”?

      Exploring this… who am I?

      Isn’t it all about inner space…
      feeling comfortable in our skin, here and now.

      Honoring peace.
      Knowing that Peace is the Source of all, I am.

      “Happiness through peace of mind, in daily living, independent of circumstances.”

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      2022/02/03 at 5:37 pm